Tuesday, 8 January 2008

What if you want kids.... and your partner doesn't?

Note: I've revised this orginal blog post in light of some valid criticisms and have explained this in the comments section.

Janet is thirty-one and soon to be thirty-two. She wants children, has always wanted children.

‘There has never been a point when I didn’t always know that it was a given that I’d have children.‘

She’s now with a partner who she has been with for six years who is the same age as she is. Yet, although he wants children some day, for him now is not the time.

‘Mark has a fear of giving up what he enjoys about his life now. None of his friends have kids yet and he has no role models his age with children. His best friend is talking about having kids but Mark sees it as pressure on him. His career is taking off, we have all these grand plans with the renovation of the house, he is worried that now is not the right time.‘

Janet is all too aware of the biological clock and the problems that she might have in conceiving.

‘At thirty-two, I wanted to be in the position of at least trying to conceive. It’s a very practical decision – I want more than one child and if we don’t start until my mid thirties conceiving the first, then I will be older when we conceive the second.‘

For Janet, the problem is around the unpredictability of what may or may not happen.

‘You don’t know how long it will take – it took a friend only two to three months to conceive. If I was to conceive now, it would be too soon. Yet, I know it could take much longer and then if there were complications, we’d have to go for tests and procedures.‘

Janet feels the unfairness of the situation – that men don’t have the same pressures or worries.
‘Men in their thirties still feel that they are young – they don’t feel the urgency of the situation. So many of my friends are in the same position. He is in denial'.

One contributor to this blog said:

'It is my observation among many of my friends (I am 31 by the way) that while my female friends are aware that this is a crucial time for fertility etc. their male partners are still keen to live their life as they did through their twenties. They are often reluctant to fully commit to their relationship let alone contemplate having kids. Newspaper articles berate 'selfish' women yet often fail to mention the other side of the story: men that are refusing to grow up and follow our biological lead.'

Often, the problem isn't that their partner has decided he wants to be childfree - the problem is that there is a lack of communication between the two about what they really want in their future, whether they want children or not.

If you are in a relationship with a man who doesn't want children, in your mid thirties and want children, you need to be bold and take the 'bull by the horns.' Questions to ask yourself before approaching your partner include:

1) How long am I prepared to wait before we start trying for a child?
2) Have I established whether he does want children?
3) What is my 'bottom line' and what am I willing to compromise on i.e I am willing to wait one year before we start trying and what am I not willing to compromise on i.e. I need to have a definate start date and I need to have a clear answer from him about whether he wants children or not.

Then, set a time and date to have a through discussion with your partner about the issue. Express your worries and concerns. Ask him is he really sees children in his future. Ask him what HIS bottom line is and what he is willing to compromise on.

I sometimes meet women who are desparate for children but in relationship with men who are very reluctant and who are constantly stalling the issue. At some point, these women have to face the issue - if having a child is so important to me, and my partner doesn't want to even discuss having a child, is this relationship viable?

I'll end this post with the story of Laura - a single mother I've interviewed for the book.

Laura had several serious long-term relationships in her early twenties and thirties. When the issue of children was brought up however, the men always prevaricated – it wasn’t the right time, they were too young, they weren’t sure - there was always some excuse.

‘I just accepted it – I thought the decision should be mutual, consensual and I shouldn’t put pressure on them. I wasn’t so worried at first – not about my fertility and I thought I had plenty of time. Most of my friends were younger and didn’t have kids and fertility didn’t seem to be a big issue.‘

As she got older, a few warning bells started to ring. Her sister and her husband were having trouble having kids and a friend of hers who left it till her early forties and was now desperate for a child made her more aware of the limitations on fertility.

At thirty-five, she spilt up from a long-term boyfriend and was single.

I was at a real crossroads – I decided to leave a job I hated and go travelling, do some volunteer work in a developing country. I was in a casual relationship - nothing serious and no demands. And then three weeks after I had left my job, rented out my flat and moved into a temporary house share, I found out I was pregnant. It was a complete accident – it just happened because I forgot to be careful.‘

Laura assumed that it would be difficult to get pregnant, that it would take planning and would take a long time but, as it happened, it didn’t.

‘I can’t believe that if it hadn’t happened like this, by accident, it might not have happened at all. My only regret is that I left it so long and that I didn’t force the issue earlier with my previous partners. I always deferred to their needs and their indecision. Now, I always say to women just get on with it! If you want kids, don’t hang about and don’t let your partners block your decision either. Waiting around for the perfect relationship or perfect time is ridiculous. I wasn’t in my ideal situation - I didn’t want to be a single parent but I am and I have this lovely little boy now. It’s a life I wouldn’t change for anything.‘

12 comments:

Gill said...

I'm on a bit of a quantum physics quest at the moment and one thing I did wonder was- if we had the choice to replicate by cloning or make 'people' out of sub atomic particles would anyone choose to physically give birth? Admittedly this is a bit off topic and all very theoretical but I wondered if any of your readers had any views on it.

queenb said...

Not wanting to have children at the moment or at all does not make you a kidult. That's because having kids is not a requirement to be mature adult. I'd say his bills, jobs and other adult responsibilities make him an adult. Not doing something the woman in his life wants him to do, exactly when she wants him to do it,does not make him immature.

Also, be careful before talking about the good old days. Yes, back then men married younger and had kids right away. And women stayed home and cleaned house and raised kids without many other options.

Women would be offended if we told them to stop being so selfish and immature by wanting an education and job instead of having kids at 18. So don't complain that men are exercising their options as well.

Beth said...

Gill - interesting point but I think probably not!! Probably becaue cloning seems abit werid!

Queenb - I totally take your point. I need to rethink how this is presented because I see how it comes across as equating choosing to be childfree with being a kidult - not what I want to do at all!

I guess what I consider immature isn't about men/women saying they want to be childfee, or that they don't want kids and being willing and able to communicate that desire to there partner - that's a pretty mature thing to do! And honest.

What I think I mean about being a kid-adult and what I think some of the women I've talked to who are in this situation, is when the guy is delaying things or trying to put off the issue through saying things like 'Oh, yes, I would like kids someday but I'm too young' And it's not when they are under 25 - this is from men in their late 30's. Or not even wanting to discuss the issue or being dismissive of their partner when they bring it up.

I think that's what is frustrating.

decided said...

I think you should be careful with making statements about maturity. Relationships involve two people with different points of view. One view isn't necessarily more mature than the other, and neither of their needs should be ignored.

I think that while these women's partners should consider giving up their freedom to fit in with their partner's needs, women should consider adoption as a viable option that might fit in with their partner's needs. The couple would still get to be parents, but it is not set to any biological clock. I would be interested to read what these women had to say about adoption.

So rather than making a wider statement about maturity, I think you should address your specific concerns - lack of communication, indecisiveness...

Beth said...

Decided - Excellent point! I think that's the problem in how I framed the discussion in the orginial post. I am tempted to revise it now but probably would be useful to leave it for more comment and also to see how my arguement progresses/develops.

Michelle said...
This post has been removed by the author.
Explosive Bombchelle said...

Like the others who have responded to your post I find your definition of kidult quite offensive.

'Kidult' - a man who doesn't want to grow up, to take on adult responsibilities. Every example of men you place this label upon seem to be very stable adults; jobs, houses, mortgages, heads on their shoulders. These aren't men in their 30s and 40s living in their mother's basement and working part time at a local fast food joint. Their choice not to procreate yet, or ever, is based on concerns over finances, time and career concerns. This is a very adult approach to the major decision of bringing a child into the world.

Your label of men being kidults is also missing the number of women who would fall within the parameter of your definition. While your might experience more women in your practice who desire children with partners who do night there are also men who desire children whose partners are delaying the decision.

Good luck with your book and research.

Britgirl said...

You may also be interested in the depth of comments here
http://thebritgirl.com/2008/01/09/on-men-kidults-and-not-wanting-kids/
Your equating of men who don't desire, or are indecisive about having children simply because of the ticking of a woman's biological clock as basically men who refuse to grow up and take on responsibility is, to me, offensive. It points the way to having unwanted children. Having children does not necessarily make either party mature. listening to each other and respecting the others decision (including the decision not to have kids)is the better sign of maturity.

There are plenty of men who have given in to the incessant pressure from their partners to have children only to find out it was a mistake to do so and to wish they had not allowed themselves to be talked into doing something they did not want to do.

Maybe their views ought be considered also rather than just women who are desperate for children?

Sandman said...
This post has been removed by a blog administrator.
Beth said...

Hi All - thanks for all your comments - the only one I deleted was rather personally nasty and wasn't that constructive! I have revised the blog entry and am thinking about the context and framing of this debate. And I think that it was decided that hit the nail on the head with her comments about not framing it in the context of maturity but rather communication or lack of!

John said...

I think you may have used the wrong term. According to Wikipedia, a "kidult" is a "grown-up" person who enjoys being a part of youth culture and doing things that are usually thought as more suitable for children, for example, playing with toys or video games...

I think what you are meaning is "biological clock engaging prevaricator" or similar.

These things happen. I recall a firestorm over a bloggers misinterpretation of the word "pouf" in relation to John Edwards. The blogger thought the word meant 'gay' when in fact it means boyant hairstyle.

Thepeteo said...

In my personal experience I've often found that women want kids because they themselves yearn to a world in which a child's needs and ambitions take precedence over an adult's. In short, they yearn to return to their childhoods, many avoid the fact that being a parent and being a child are different things altogether and if that modern parents were all doing a good job we'd meet a whole lot fewer antisocial and damaged people.

When I met my partner I told her I never wanted kids, she accepted that but after a year together she announced quite suddenly that she wanted children, I still don't. I'm thirty and she's thirty one. My concerns over rearing kids are many and varied, some personal - I had a bad childhood and don't value family in the same way she does, others are practical, it'd be crushingly expensive and the biggest investment of my adult life, my house, would be sacrificed on the alter of parenthood. Others are for and because of the world in which we live; do we need more people here? Are the people I see having lots of kids going to do a good enough job to ensure that my child isn't stuck in a world with more unpleasant people than there even are now? I love my girlfriend dearly but I've had six months of incessant pressure on the issue. I've even caved in on and agreed to have children with her, to sell my house, pay off her mortgage and to financially support her so she doesn't have to work for the first five years of our child/children's lives. My condition being that if we're to do it, we're to do a good job of it - She protested about losing her job. I've said that although having kids terrifies me, I would do the best job as a father that I could and put our offspring first. She's not happy with this - She wants me to be happy and excited about the decision to have kids and not just accepting...

I've been honest from the start, I'm responsible, independant, I have a career, I'm driven by logical decisions, I'm a generous, loving partner what else must I do to prove that my decision to NOT have children is not because I'm trapped in some selfish prolonged childhood? With a childhood like the one I had, the first sixteen years of my life were spent trying to escape it! Calling men like me 'kiddults' is highly insulting and I would counter that the women who say "I want it so I deserve to get it" are perhaps the ones who didn't learn a very prevalant maxim often cited to children: "I want doesn't get". A final applicable trueism: "A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush".

I'm waiting for her to confirm whether or not she's prepared to stay with me, I've been waiting for a fortnight now, she doesn't want to get my stuff together so I can pick it up because that's "too final", yet she doesn't want to see me either. If this relationship ends it'll be the third one I've lost since I was twenty because my partners wanted kids and I didn't. I reiterate; Am I stuck in childhood? Am I "a kiddult"?